Hi who you thing is the most controversial history figure in your country’s history and why ?

32 comments

  1. oh boy… like there is a long list of controversial history figures here and every can easily compete to be the most controversial .

  2. Churchill. No one inspires more adoration and more condemnation than he does in the UK. The marmite man personified.

  3. Otto Wille Kuusinen, a Finnish communist.

    He was one of the leaders of Reds during Finnish Civil War. After Reds lost the war, he fled to USSR. During Winter War, he was the leader of [Terijoki Government](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_Democratic_Republic) which was meant to become the puppet government of USSR in Finland had USSR occupied Finland.

    He is the only Finn that has been buried in Kremlin Wall in Moscow.

  4. Given that there is no controversy about the Nazis bar some lunatics, they’re/were all evil people, I’d say Otto von Bismarck is quiet controversial, even today.

    Some see him as a genius, but wise statesman, who forged Germany with blood and iron but afterwards had the forsightedness to keep Germany out of conflicts, not engage with colonisalism and entrench Germany in the european diplomatic concert, appeasing both the Russians and the Brits and the inventor of social security policies

    While others see him as the main perpetuator of anti-democratic behaviour in Germany, who took away every chance of natural democratization of Germany through a liberal movement. A reactionary force, a warmonger who fought the socialdemocrats and any form of liberalization, whose policies sooner or later would have let into a similar isolation of Germany and a similar 1. WW.

    Honorary Mentions:

    Frederick the Great, Martin Luther, Franz-Josef Strauß, Karl Marx, Erwin Rommel, Frederick Barbarossa, maybe even Wilhelm II. and Paul von Hindenburg.

  5. Napoléon. You either love him or you hate him. And it’s the same all over the world. I can’t think of an illustrious figure as controversial as Napoleon. Some historians see him as a man of peace, others as a bloodthirsty conqueror. Some see him as the protector of the French revolution, others as the re-establishment of a quasi-monarchical system. Some admire him as a statesman who left his mark on his time and on future generations, while others see him only as a passing tyrant. In short, he leaves no one indifferent.

  6. Definitely António de Oliveira Salazar, the former dictator back when Portugal was under the Estado Novo regime. I think most hold a negative opinion towards him, though he does have his defenders and people that claim that neither him or the dictatorship were “that bad”.

  7. In older history, basically all of the known vikings (national heroes that were basically pirates and did ritualistic human sacrifice and rape)

    In newer history I would maybe choose Knut Hamsun, maybe our greatest author, but also more or less a Nazi.

  8. Probably Knut Hamsun. Arguably one of the most famous Norwegian writers, but was a nazi sympathizer during WW2 to the point where he even donated his Nobel price to Joseph Goebbels.

    But his works such as Hunger and Growth of the Soil are still considered great literature.

  9. Wojciech Jaruzelski, an army officer back from WW2, First Secretary of the Polish United Workers’ Party throughout the 80s as well as a de-facto military dictator between 1981 and 1983.

    In short, Jaruzelski was on one hand a victim of Stalinist repressions who fought against the Nazis in WW2 and his decision to invoke martial law likely saved Poland from a Soviet invasion similar to that in Hungary and Czechoslovakia, and he also enabled the peaceful transition to democracy in 1989. On the other hand, he was a dictator and during his rule hundreds of people died or disappeared and thousands more were imprisoned without trial, corruption was rampant and the economy crashed into the ground, although that’s probably more the fault of his predecessors.

  10. It could be Edward Gierek, in 70s he developed industry, quality of life of Poles, and opened Poland into some western inventions, as colour television, coca-cola, American films and cartons in TV, but on the other hand was still loyal of Brezhnev, in 1976 he changed constitution of communist Poland into broader alliance with Soviet Union, he also retained and expanded Katyn liar, and his development based on credits let Poland into huge crisis in next decade.

  11. Two key figures come to mind.

    [Józef Piłsudski](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B3zef_Pi%C5%82sudski?wprov=sfti1#), military leader, pivotal character, initially a socialist activist, instrumental in regaining independence in 1918 and shaping the new state. He crushed the Soviet invasion in [battle of Warsaw](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Warsaw_(1920)?wprov=sfti1#) in 1920, saving Europe from their further advancement.

    On the other hand, he expressed authoritarian tendencies, staged a coup in 1926 in order to „heal” the chaotic political life of a fledgling democracy, then proceeded to suppress opposition, being a de facto state leader until his death in 1935.

    Still he has been viewed mostly positively and with nostalgia, as a key statesman, with a certain cult developed around him. Polish politics took a visible right-wing, nationalist turn after he passed away (1935-1939). [There’s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfZd1RGR_Js) his original voice, recorded in 1924.

    [Stanisław August Poniatowski](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanis%C5%82aw_August_Poniatowski?wprov=sfti1#), last king of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, on the one hand an enlightened reformer caring about spreading education, who supported reforming the state and introducing a modern [constitution](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_3_May_1791?wprov=sfti1) in 1791, one of the first ones in the world.

    On the other hand he was easily influenced and manipulated by foreign powers, had an affair with Russian empress Catherine the Great, didn’t manage to prevent the partitions and ultimately led to the Commonwealth’s demise in 1795.

  12. My fellow Czechs help me, please… could Edvard Beneš be considered controversial in a way? He had to make a lot of hard decisions and some may blame him that he gave up.

  13. I recall Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim for Finland. He was a military leader and politician who played a significant role in Finland’s history, particularly during World War II. Mannerheim’s controversial legacy stems from his complex involvement in Finnish politics, including his leadership of the Finnish White Army during the Finnish Civil War and his subsequent collaboration with Nazi Germany during World War II. While some view him as a national hero for his leadership against Soviet aggression, others criticize his alliances and actions during turbulent times.

  14. Josip Broz Tito is by far the most controversial. Half of the country sees him as a hero while the other half sees him as a villain.

  15. Probably Silvio Berlusconi. Half of the Italians adore him while the for the other half is like Satan.

  16. Enver Hoxha, our ex-dictactor, some of the older generation love him but the newer generation hates him

  17. There are plenty. Atatürk, Erdoğan, Enver Pasha.

    Atatürk is our founder, contravertial for abolishing caliphate and sharia among religious.

    Erdoğan is contravertial for changing many things that Atatürk have done among seculars.

    Enver Pasha is really contravertial, he is one of three pashas who is responsible for Armenian genocide however he is praised by Turkists and seen as a failed revolutionist before Atatürk.

  18. Josip Broz Tito is definitely the answer for all ex-Yugoslav states. The share of people who love him or hate him depends on the country and generation, of course.

    In Croatia specifically another controversial person would be Franjo Tuđman, our first post-communist president. Croatia became independent under his rule, but he was also an authoritarian nationalist.

  19. Probably Oliver Cromwell. He ushered in lots of reforms that made our country more democratic today but he was also particularly brutal in war. It seems he’s either loved or hated and no in-between

  20. * **Gustav Vasa** – first king of post-Kalmar Union Sweden, also seen as the founder of *modern* Sweden. Brilliant politician and a man of realpolitik and decisive action when it was needed, and measured caution when the situation asked for that instead.

    However, he did have something of a tyrant about him. From commissioning legends about his “adventures” during the rebellion against Denmark, to the brutal suppression of dissidence, to the combination of stories and legends of his infamously violent temper. IIRC, he had two German chamberlains who would later complain of him physically assaulting them during his temper tantrums (in one case supposedly using *a hammer!*). After being notified that his eldest daughter had indulged in some pre-marital sex with a young nobleman, he pulled her hair so bad that, according to her, some of it *was pulled off her head!*

    While he undoubtedly did provide Sweden with the stability, organization and geopolitical framework to form a good foundation for later great feats, his cynism and violent tendencies have also become infamous.

  22. At the moment it’s probably [Jan Pieterszoon Coen](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Pieterszoon_Coen). He was the governor-general of the VOC’s posessions in Southeast Asia. He’s widely honoured in the form of street names, statues, etc. however he’s the main person responsible for the massacres and mass enslavements committed on the Banda Islands in modern day Indonesia.

    There’s been quite a bit of controversy in recent years surrounding his statue in his hometown of Hoorn. Some people want it removed but the general population of Hoorn wants it to stay despite the atrocities he committed.

  23. For Turkey, probably Atatürk. As the founding father of the modern republic, he revolutionized the whole country in a very radical way. At the time, Ottoman intellectuals could be split into two, those that deemed Islam as the core problem and those that wanted to combine Ottoman Islam with modernism and/or materialism. The common folk was mostly religious and conservative, had no national identity, most never saw a school and those that did were educated in “religion schools”. Very high percentage of the common folk were illiterate.

    Ataturk implemented French style laïcité (secularism) with strong disdain for Islam and a strong national identity that is tied closely with a hypothesised a “Turkish race” whose origins were from Central Asia. The country developed quickly, literacy increased to record heights, a national identity quickly formed and created unison. A very well educated generation was created within 15 years.

    With his death, the country went into a cycle of common folk trying to abolish some of Atatürk’s revolutions, mostly related to religion, and the military trying to protect those revolutions. Military won up until the last Erdogan regime. Erdogan was able to take the military down. Erdogan is surrounded by an army of “supporters” that are trying to take their piece of the state resources.

    Today, there are couple of sides (very simplified):

    – Ataturk is god, peace with religion, Kurds are fine, pro west
    – Ataturk is god, anti religion, anti Kurd, pro west
    – Ataturk is god, ultra nationalist, strongly anti Kurd, peaceful with religion, neutral to West
    – Ataturk is devil, ultra radical Islamist, wants to adopt Islamic law, anti West
    – Ataturk is elitist so they don’t feel represented, peace with Islam, anti Kurd, anti West
    – Left wing Kurds, anti Ataturk, peace with Islam, pro West
    – Right wing Kurds, anti Ataturk, radical Islam, anti West

    Sorry if I forgot some of you!

  24. King Franz Joseph.
    On one hand, his rule was a golden age, Hungary became a modern, industrial country.

    On the other hand, he was a tyrant, who ended our Revolution in bloodshed. His diplomatic inability isolated the Empire, and his policies directly lead to the first World War, and Trianon.

  25. Mine is Quassi of Timotibo. We learn about him in school. He was an enslaved person who emancipated himself. Became a doctor, botanist, and much more. The root word in hydroxychloroquine probably comes from his name. We learn about him in school because he has done much in finding remedies for diseases and is kinda an inspiration. He also used his knowledge of the land to help the colonists hunt and capture escaped enslaved people. He had his own plantation with his own enslaved people. He had his ear cut off in a fight. Because we learned out of dutch schoolbooks, he was seen as a hero and inspiration. The descendants of those runaway enslaved people call him a traitor. It was kinda weird to read about how he did so many great things and then find out he helped the dutch find runaway enslaved people and had his own plantation.

  26. Aside from… the obvious choice I would also say people like Wilhelm II. and Bismarck, same with Konrad Adenauer

  27. Leopold II, it’s not even a competition. Lots of architectural marvels that still stand to this day were commissioned and constructed under his reign, but he’s basically only remembered for the shit he did in the Congo.

  28. Nicolae Ceaușescu is the only answer for Romania. Imagine having a Revolution in 89 in which people were killed and 30 some years later people saying that he was the only capable man of taking this country forward

  29. In recent history it probably has to be De Valera, was instrumental in the struggle for independence but is also blamed for the ultra conservatism of early independent Ireland and not doing enough to fix the major economic issues Ireland had for the first 40 odd years of independence

  30. Charles XII I think. Today he is a white supremacy icon, which is quite funny because he really wasn’t a very good king. He inherited a very strong Swedish empire and early on had a lot of very strong victories, but he didn’t know when to stop. After all was said and done he’d lost the Estonia, Latvia, part of Pomerania, Bremen, and the area around present day St. Petersburg. Sweden was bankrupt and left without a stable heir. The next hundred years of recovery were extremely rough ultimately resulting in the loss of the eastern half of the country (present day Finland) to Russia. All because a teenager didn’t know when to stop

  31. Jozef Tiso for sure. On one hand he was a catholic priest and first Slovak president thanks to whom the Slovaks enjoyed rather high quality of life during WW2 on the other hand he was a strong antisemite who was responsible for sending up to 80.000 Slovaks with Jewish ethnicity to concentration camps where like 90%+ of them died for what he was executed after the war…

  32. Georgios Grivas Digenis

    He led the EOKA freedom struggle against the British colonial forces. After that he organized and led EOKA B, to stage a coup to overthrow the Cypriot government, with the blessings of the Greek military junta and Kissinger

    Nowadays far right people belonging to the ELAM political party (and some belonging to DISY) love him, while the rest of the people hate him for what he’s done.

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