I was on a date with my husband when he made a remark saying that the waiters must think he has weird taste. I asked what he meant by that and it basically came out that he doesn’t think that I’m conventionally attractive, and that I’m attractive “in my own way”. He tried reassuring me that he thinks I’m attractive which honestly I don’t doubt, but I realised he thinks I’m attractive in the way I think some interesting looking celebrities are attractive, I like them but I don’t expect anyone else to.
I’m not the most secure person in my appearance but before today I never doubted his attraction to me. He’s very conventionally attractive and when we talked about it at home he said that maybe the waitstaff just thought he had low self esteem or that I have a great personality. He said once someone talks to me they’d find me attractive but not from a distance and that I have a masculine face.
He’s not a malicious person at all but has terrible social skills and cues which make it worse, I know he was just being honest and genuine and didn’t understand why I was so upset since he really does find me really attractive to him and that I’m pretty “in my own way”. He says it’s not the most important thing in a relationship which I agree with but it still hurts. He’s normally very reassuring and helps with my self confidence a lot.
I think I’m so upset because it’s true but it hurts to know he thinks it too. My question is do I just take it on the chin and move on or should I have another conversation with him? Should I even be mad at him or is it a ridiculous thing to be upset over?
TL;DR: husband said I wasn’t conventionally attractive but pretty ‘in my own way’ and I’m not sure how to feel about it.
27 comments
Oh, I know this game. There’s this stupid notion out there in the manosphere that if you tank your girlfriends self-esteem she will be less demanding, more eager to please, and less likely to think she can do better if she goes elsewhere.
Sometimes it works and he’ll reap the benefit of getting to be a lazier more selfish partner.
Sometimes it backfires and the girlfriend doesn’t want to be with someone who doesn’t find them attractive and casually insults them on dates.
Do not just accept these insults. You won’t make it through the next 6 decades if he keeps doing this.
Is he perhaps listening to certain podcasts that tell him you’ll be faithful if he destroys your self esteem? I’m not so certain there isn’t an element of malice here – that’s a fucked up thing to say to your spouse.
It’s a weird comment, almost like the old pickup negging strategy. You should definitely voice your feelings on it. Just to prevent it in the future
Your husband was redpilled and is trying his hand at negging you so your self esteem is in the gutter and you let him get away with all sorts of degrading selfish shit because you think you can’t do any better.
Honestly, what he said was incredibly thoughtless and cruel.
You mentioned, “I’m not the most secure person in my appearance.” **A loving partner’s job is to be a safe harbor from those insecurities, not to become the source of them.** For him to know you’re sensitive about this and then specifically pick at it is a huge failure of care on his part. The line that really stands out is his concern for what the waiters might think. **In that moment, he prioritized the imaginary judgment of complete strangers over your feelings. He essentially stepped outside of your partnership, looked at you both from a distance, and sided with the critics.** That’s not a “us against the world” bond a marriage should have.
“He said once someone talks to me they’d find me attractive but not from a distance and that I have a masculine face.” is tactless cruelty. You can be honest without being destructive. Telling your wife she has a “masculine face” is a deeply personal and hurtful critique that will now live in your head forever. There was no reason to say that, period.
You’re right to be upset. This isn’t about whether he’s “malicious” or just has “terrible social skills.” His intent doesn’t cancel out the impact. He needs to understand that. His “honesty” came at the expense of your emotional safety. Do not “take it on the chin.” Resentment from moments like this builds up and poisons a relationship. You need to have another conversation, focusing on the impact, not his intent.
An apology is the bare minimum. What you really need is for him to understand why it was so wrong so that he never, ever makes you feel that way again.
personally I would be offended if I were in your shoes. that was a real dick move on his part and that was a self esteem blow from someone who was supposed to be safe to you.
Excuse me? Your husband is an absolute idiot! Your partner should make you feel like the most amazing person in all aspects of life.
“maybe the waitstaff thought he had low self esteem” that’s not ‘not conventionally attractive’ that’s downright mean. I am shocked and for saying this he deserves the biggest ass kicking in the universe.
You know what? I’m 100% convinced you’re gorgeous. Your husband however is one of the saddest creatures of men I’ve ever heard of. If his wife isn’t glowing, no radiating, shining like a star that’s on him. He is dulling your sparkle with those degrading comments that speak more of his own arrogance than your looks. What he is really saying is “I could do better” and he wants you to know. I’m disgusted!!!
Wow, I have no words. This is … I mean … this is exceptionally hurtful and disrespectful.
The worst part is that it was also entirely unprompted, which tells you that while you’re out together thinking something nice about him and how happy you are, he is thinking what he just told you or worse. I can’t even begin to imagine what his interior monologue sounds like.
I think for a lot of people this would be a dealbreaker.
Oh god please don’t let this be real.
That was malicious, stupid or both. Hopefully a one time event.
His job is to make you feel sexy, among other things. If he’s doing the opposite, you might need to reconsider your relationship.
He’s negging you
It’s a form of psychological abuse
They do it to ruin your self-esteem so you don’t get any ideas about leaving or cheating.
It’s messed up. Instead of just treating your partner well so they don’t leave, they choose to bully them instead.
He’s normally very reassuring, but suddenly out of nowhere, for the very first time, he makes an insulting remark like this and then doubles down on it later that night? What suddenly changed?
This is one of those things that is mean just by being said out loud. There’s no way you could frame it that is less mean, because it starts from a place of bad faith. Everyone is attractive “in their own way,” even conventionally attractive people. To assume that other people wouldn’t find you attractive “from a distance” or “until someone talks to you” is objectively false. People’s tastes are as varied as people’s faces are, and it’s crazy-making to spend any amount of time thinking about the full range of opinions people could have about your looks.
Has he literally never expressed this opinion before now? Is he finally echoing a sentiment that you say about yourself? You BOTH need to be more kind to you, you don’t deserve this.
This is so sad and cruel. Op I’m sorry but this douche isn’t kind and this behavior isn’t just “bad social skiĺls”. It’s a deliberate attempt to knock your self esteem down and keep you trying to impress him and proving yourself to him.
This man doesn’t like you. I recommend checking out /u/burbnbougie on YouTube. She has a lot of great videos on this type of dude and how to spot their bullshit
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: straight relationships don’t work unless the man loves the woman more than she loves him.
If he’s thoughtless, do you want to be with someone like that? Do you want this to be a future child’s inner voice? In the alternative, he knew what he was doing, it wasn’t an offhand comment, and he did it to be hurtful and cruel. Pick your poison babe, it’s poison either way.
Yesterday you said ______. I’m curious. Why did you say that?
Yes but why did you say it?
But why did you SAY it?
Him1: I was just being honest.
Him2: It’s the truth.
Him3: It’s not that deep.
Then why did you say it?
************************
For further discussion:
I’m surprised that you would say something you knew would hurt me.
How was your comment actionable for me?
Yes, but was it an important truth? More important than kindness?
What was your intention in bringing that up?
I can guarantee you’re more attractive than your husband. But this sounds like some degrading comments so your self esteem is in the toilet, resulting in you thinking you may not be able to get anyone else. Don’t stand for this, it’s not right!
I mean, if we grant that this wasn’t malicious and that he genuinely just so lacks any empathy or social awareness that definitely pushes this into the kind of scary territory. I mean this is a 27 year old with no capacity to reflect on what he is saying at all, this is a guy that can say something like “he said that maybe the waitstaff just thought he had low self esteem or that I have a great personality” and not understand that he did you a charity speaking to you in the first place. A partner like that is dangerous because they just do not think through or care about what they say and given he defaults to some pretty horrific bullshit that’s a problem.
But that’s the ‘positive’ take on this. The reality is if he gets it, if he understands what he is saying, that’s just negging. That’s him going out of his way to make you feel self conscious, to establish a gap between you, to make sure you always feel thankful for him humouring you. And that’s a potent manipulation tactic, especially given you already had shaky self esteem.
I’d have the conversation and ask him to really think about what he thought would come of saying that, in what world saying something like that wouldn’t hurt a partner. And if he genuinely doesn’t get it, well, what does that say about his empathy, why does he find it so hard to think about how others would feel, does he have concerns that is a problem.
Maybe he is a spoiled conventionally attractive twit that has gotten away with talking crazy crap for a long time because he’s okay looking. I start to worry that part of why he married you then is that you tolerated it.
Why the fuck would anyone say this to their wife?
I would dump his ass at the earliest . Such men are bad news in the long run.
Classic case of negging . If he didn’t find you attractive he wouldn’t be with you in the first place . But he is purposefully germinating seeds of subtle doubt in your head making you question your worth just so that he can come across as generous to “endure” your looks and love you “despite” your looks .
My wife (We’re both women) spends so much loving time and energy making me feel beautiful. She knows I’m insecure about my looks so she puts in so much effort telling me and showing me how beautiful she thinks I am.
I have been in plenty of relationships (with men) who want to remind me how lucky I was that they deigned to stoop low enough to find me attractive.
One of the most important jobs your partner has is to make you feel loved. If he can’t do that, you can find someone who will. You deserve to feel beautiful. You ARE beautiful.
Dude hates you. Be on the lookout for what comes next.
Don’t put up with this nonsense.
OP you’ve mentioned he’s not malicious.
Who’s gonna tell her🙃
He’s 27 girl there’s no fucking way he just has “bad social skills” and ended up saying something like that. Any normal person wouldn’t continue this conversation but he proceeded to make it even more insulting at home.
He said that to you to make you feel bad. Whether he subconsciously wanted to hurt your feelings or made a conscious decision to tell you this, either way equals the same thing. He wanted you to feel hurt and feel bad for whatever reason he has going on in his head.
Someone who acts this way has a lot of darkness inside of them. They will be toxic in a relationship until they can heal and learn how to be a good person.
Imo your husband either 1. Has low self esteem and wants you to think he is the best by making you feel inferior and think you can’t do better.. or 2. He feels contempt for you and wants you to be fearful that he can find someone better than you in a twisted power play/ manipulation tactic.
He wants you to think that you could never find anyone better than him. He’s very full of himself and selfish it sounds like.
I’m confused what prompted these comments to start with – did the wait staff behave weirdly or make comments? Or why did he even go there?
I’m with other comments. This is negging. It has zero to do with social cues and it IS malicious. I think you need to sit down again and explain what you did here: that these things made you uncomfortable and that it was rude. His reaction will tell you a lot. The one thing he’s right about is that physical desire is not the cornerstone of a relationship. Mutual respect and affection mean much more. Stand up for yourself and have open communication. Good luck.